Making a Messiah, Pt. 1 (What do we know about the NT authors?)
The first part in a new video series, exploring the role the New Testament authors played in shaping the character of Jesus Christ into their vision of the Jewish messiah.
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Sources:
1. The Conflicting Genealogies of Jesus –
http://flyingbagpiper.blogspot.com/2007/07/conflicting-genealogies-of-jesus.html
Duration : 0:6:58
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Wow! You sure stir …
Wow! You sure stir up the hornets! Keep on!
So far so good. You …
So far so good. You are quoting from the BIBLE. Let’s see #2
I suggest you read …
I suggest you read Luke 1;26-42 which describe the conception of Jesus six months after John’s.
Perhaps not, …
Perhaps not, dumbshit, but every bible will have the text I posted where JOHN THE BAPTIST is born to the priest Zachariah.
Your intellectual dishonesty makes this truly done, fuckhead. Last post to you ever.
sonofviper,
Once …
sonofviper,
Once again you have proved what a foul-mouthed idiot you are. You are so stupid that you dont even realise that these commentaries arent scripture and that not all bibles have them, only some modern versions.
Fuck you and the …
you and the horse you rode in on dickhead. I post the actual versus and the actual title and it is clear what it is referring to and you STILL try to lie about it. YOU YOU MOTHER FUCKER!
So, once again we …
So, once again we find that you try to tell that some bible verse refers to the birth of Jesus and ONCE AGAIN I school you and show that it refers to something else entirely, this time the birth of JOHN THE BAPTIST. I ask you again, don’t you feel the least bit slimey lying about your holy book?
Further, what I have proven with actual history, again, is that Herod was a TRIBUTE paying king, a CLIENT KING. Augustus did not levy direct taxation until they became a direct PROVINCE, in 6ad.
LOL son of viper. …
LOL son of viper. Title to verse 5. So who wrote this title?
Guess why I call you an incompetent idiot?
son of viper based his data on incomplete data, ignoring real historical records called Scriptures and circumstantial evidence from Josephus. Go back to your rottening documents and eat what you cant find.
Reading on we find …
Reading on we find
Luke 1:11Then an angel of the Lord appeared to him, standing at the right side of the altar of incense. 12When Zechariah saw him, he was startled and was gripped with fear. 13But the angel said to him: “Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to give him the name John.
Immediately before …
Immediately before verse 5 the title of the chapter is “the birth of John the baptist foretold”. Luke 1:5In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah
3) There is no …
3) There is no circumstantial evidence from Josephus. Once again, Josephus confirms the census in Judea as being 6ad when Quirinius was governor and ONCE AGAIN links this to the rebellion of Judas the Galilean.
ONCE AGAIN I school you with your own bible verses and actual history. GIVE IT UP FUCKTARD. YOU HAVE NOTHING!
son of viper proves …
son of viper proves that Herod Gt used Roman armies. All the more reason for Augustus to tax them.
1) Once again, I …
1) Once again, I already stated this. Please read back to what I posted. The Censitores were seperate from the Governors. Quirinius was NOT a Censitores but a LEGATE, who could also conduct census, as already stated.
2)Correct. The 6ce census was not empire wide, but only concerning Judea. The 8bc census WAS Roman world wide and DID occur across all of the ACTUAL provinces of the Roman world but not client states or tributory kingdoms. There is NO reference from Luke for a census around 5bc
The romans did …
The romans did expect money. The semi-autonomous state of Judea was, what did I call it before…that’s right a CLIENT KINGDOM. They paid TRIBUTE to Rome.
As to the Roman interventions during the time of Herod the Great, this was first in 39-37 bce under Mark Antony that placed Herod in power. Then in 32 bce the was against the Nabateans occurs, largely with Roman troops drawn from Syria and Egypt but with some local troops drawn from the CLIENT KINGDOM OF JUDEA.
Where in Scripture …
Where in Scripture is this verse “THE BIRTH OF JOHN THE BAPTIST FORETOLD. “??
This is a commentary not scriptural verse you idiot.
However, Luke 1:5In …
However, Luke 1:5In the time of Herod king of Judea there was a priest named Zechariah, who belonged to the priestly division of Abijah; his wife Elizabeth was also a descendant of Aaron is referring to the birth of JOHN THE BAPTIST. The title of the chapther right before verse 5? THE BIRTH OF JOHN THE BAPTIST FORETOLD. ONCE AGAIN I catch you in a straight up LIE concerning your own bible. Luke 1:5 has NOTHING to do with the birth of Jesus.
Ok, dickhead, time …
Ok, dickhead, time to school you again. Mathew 2:1After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem
This DOES refer to the birth of Jesus in the time of Herod the Great. This is further confirmed by Mathew 2:22But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning in Judea in place of his father Herod
Actual facts:
…
Actual facts:
1Censitores were usually disassocited from governorship. They were elected differently from proconsuls and praetors, who did not have to get personally involved
2 The 6CE census was not an empire-wide one. The 8BC one was and census did not occur simultaneously in every province/state under Roman rule. According to Luke, there was a census in Judaea around 5BC. There’s no way you can know more than him 2K years later from sketchy data
3There’s circumstantial evidence from Josephus
sonofviper,
note …
sonofviper,
note your own words “semi-autonomous” but requiring the intervention of the Syrian troops to quash at least 2 rebellions in the days of Herod the Great, when 5000 pious Jews were killed. Herod also murdered all the temple priests bar one with the help of Roman troops. So you think the Romans dont expect money in return? You know very little history period.
sonofviper,
You are …
sonofviper,
You are a lying megalomaniac, who cant even do a search properly. Matthew refers to Jesus birth in the days of Herod (MATT 2;1), just as Luke refers to John’s birth in the days of Herod (LUKE 1;5). So both accounts agree.
…BOTH incorrect …
…BOTH incorrect as BOTH Mathew AND Luke put the birth of Jesus WELL beyond 8bc. Said census, as I have ALSO conclusively shown, didn’t include Judea anyway. No, what I have done is successfully destroyed yet another apologist retard who did EVERYTHING he could do including straight up lying about sections of the bible and attempting to twist around ACTUAL history to make Luke and Mathew fit. You lose. Now off retard.
…as Judea was an …
…as Judea was an semi-autonomous client state. This was the reason why Qurinius was sent in alongside the governor of Judea in the first place. No census had been done and Augustus ordered one to be done. As I have conclusively shown, a census was done independent of the governor by the Censitores or by Imperial Legate, which Quirinius was. Lastly I have shown that NONE of Augustus’ census match the time periods mentioned in the bible unless you now wish to tell me that Luke and Mathew are…
No, what I have …
No, what I have shown you is the actual facts. I have conclusively shown that Quirinius was not anywhere in the vicinity of Judea UNTIL 6ad, your first attempt at this argument. I have conclusively shown that there was NO census in Judea prior to 6ad, your many other attempts at argument. I have conclusively shown that the census that DID occur in Judea occured in 6ad, this from historical records outside of the bible. I have conclusively shown that Augustus’ census did NOT include Judea…
You have not shown …
You have not shown me anything that can refute Luke’s account. All you have shown me is that your are a sorry piece of rude and incompetent megalomaniac.
And may God judge you accordingly.
The 6CE census was …
The 6CE census was not an empire-wide census. The 8BC one was and you, claiming to be a historian, should know that the censuses did not happen simultaneously in every Roman province. It is therefore quite within the duration that by the time it got to Judaea, it would be 6-5BCE. Yes, Herod was given the autonomy with a client status but this didnt mean Augustus couldnt include Judaea in his worldwide census. Certainly there was no mention of any Judaean gorvernor and there was one in 6AD.